The Gym Owners Blog/Podcast/Measure, Prove & Guarantee your Clients’ Success

Measure, Prove & Guarantee your Clients’ Success

Saturday, January 28, 2023

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measurables, people, work, coach, clients, gym, nutrition, body composition, business, talking, person, scan, paying, piece, week, owners, success, successful


  • ​Introducing this week’s episode - 0:02
  • ​The importance of setting expectations up front - 5:25
  • ​The new fat positive body movement is tainted - 9:23
  • ​The top 10 metrics for why people choose a gym besides being closest to their home - 13:59
  • ​Don’t let your clients hide away from success by avoiding accountability - 19:26
  • ​If you want to scale the importance of why, you as the gym owner have to buy in - 25:19
  • ​Was it too easy? Or too hard? - 30:59
  • ​What does retention look like when you have people come in? - 35:25
  • ​The one thing you need to do with your coaching business - 40:50
  • ​What metrics are you checking? - 45:05
  • ​What if you’re good at your job, but you have a problem? - 48:00


Tyler 00:02

Ladies, Gentlemen, welcome to this week's episode of the gym owners podcast. I'm your host, Tyler stone over there is John. Hi, John.

John Fairbanks 00:09

Hey, Tyler.

Tyler 00:11

Before we get started today, I want you guys to go over to the gym owners revolution, the gym owners revolution is a Facebook group, there, we've got all sorts of cool shit we dropped, we're going to be running a kind of a free little thing for you to do, and they're in the next. So about a month away, I know we've been running this promotion for a long time, but it is about a month away, we're going to be running this month and a half away, month and a half away. But you're gonna for free be able to kind of go through and like touch up a lot of good shit in your business. And at the end of this little couple of 20-30 minutes a day challenge, you'll be able to really be selling higher ticket items, you're gonna fix a lot of stuff from your offer stack to your, the products you offer to your sales, not everything's gonna rule. So it's a free thing we're going to do to get you get you guys started, because we found that we're in the business of helping gym owners who are a bit stuck, right a bit stuck not making the money they want to make are kind of just at a plateau either stuck very early or stuck in that middle that midway through the development of the business to where they're just don't quite have the money to just sink a ton of money into their development. So we decided the thing we're going to do next month is going to be to help you by kickstarting all that shit for you for free. So get in the Facebook group, we're going to help you kickstart the way you make some real money so that eventually you can then be operating at a higher level. So then you can pay us to really take your business up to the stratosphere. So get in there the links in our description for the gym owners revolution Facebook group. And let's jump right into the podcast, follow the show at the gym owners podcast and Instagram, follow John at Jay banks FL on Instagram and follow me at Tyler F and stone on Instagram. Today, we're going to talk about something that we try to include in almost all of the fitness offer stacks that we have our gym owners and coaches and personal trainers sell. And it's not a thing that is expensive. It's not a thing that you're going to make a ton of money doing. But I think it is a very critical piece in the operations of your business from top to bottom, from your retention strategy to quality control what's going on on the floor of your gym, making sure that your clients are held accountable as well, to the things they're doing outside of the gym, to their effort in the gym, and to the things that they just chose early on when it comes to defining the terms of success. So making your clients successful is what makes you successful as a coach, and being able to monetize that process is what makes you successful as a gym owner. So it's really important. So this product is simply measurable. How are you measuring results for your clients? So in our offer stacks, somewhere in there, I like to bake it in depending on how the products flow. But usually, I am almost included in all of my nutrition stuff. Anytime I'm selling anything where there's a level where there's nutrition, I don't go in my stack, I don't go there's you know, we don't go like training and then training plus nutrition, and then training plus nutrition plus measurables. I almost like the flow where it's just when we're doing nutrition, we're doing measurables we're doing whether it's body fat scans or calipers or, or even if by the way, this may not just be a sport to know what measurables it's not just about body composition can be in what I do, it almost is exclusively for a lot of weight loss, muscle building fat loss clients. But when I do get into the world or like you know, Gordon, one of our guys and gear academies, is heavily into sports performance, especially with youth. We do an in like fucking body fat scans on kids that are 12 1314 years old, you're not going to get into that much. But they are there for a reason. What is that? Right? And we're not going to be able to measure necessarily like is this kid being a fucking man? Finally, has he stopped being such a wuss? You know, it is easy to work. But their parents are there for something performance based. And so are you measuring this thing we've talked about before with our assessor song assessments and stuff like that as well. Yeah, the person wants their kid to be faster and jump higher and be stronger than we are going to need some metrics for that. So that by the end of this whatever commitment we've made, especially with youth, stuff like that is that like this is short term commitment, then they go off to their sports, and then they come back to so like you need to be able to touch it with where things are. And then at the end of your arrangement, here's what's improved. And that's extremely important. So whatever that is, and maybe just start for this when it comes to measurables. How do we determine what we need to offer for measurables? It starts with how you deliver your sales process. Because the first conversation you should have with a sales process is what are you looking to accomplish in the next few months? Because that is your opportunity. And even if they say a bunch of other stuff, like I was gonna say perfect, double. I like to double down at that moment in that conversation. And I like to say, so what would you do? But what would need to happen for you to define this experience as a success? Like what would happen for this to be for you to say this was a very successful endeavor? And they'll say exactly, if I could lose 10 pounds, if I could fit into my jeans, if I could just look better or feel great, let's find out what we need to do measurables wise to make that count, because if you're not doing it, there's nothing to even hold them accountable to staying on track.

John Fairbanks 05:25

Well, and we've talked about this before, which is its expectation setting and the importance of setting those expectations up front, you can absolutely guarantee that you will not be successful with every single client that you meet, a guarantee you won't be if you do not establish what the expectation of what this exchange is all about. Why are they coming to work with you? Why are they bothering to spend money with you, because if you don't have that be clear, when they get to the end of the month, or four or eight weeks, or six weeks or 12 weeks. If you weren't clear on what they were trying to achieve, they will blame you. Because they paid Yes. And so this is where we didn't. And I think it's good to note that it's when we were originally doing and starting to play with how we would package services and how we would do this with clients and then with gym owners to help them start doing it. Even for personal trainers. We didn't have this accountability measurable piece that was originally tied with nutrition, until we really started to realize how much more powerful the nutrition part. And the accountability part got when we introduced this and ultimately combined for good

Tyler 06:43

when someone is looking at hiring a fitness coach for any reason, whether it's weight loss or whatever, whatever that is, right? Unless they're already established and their nutrition habits and stuff, which then if I'm being totally honest with you, like, I'm just not that interested in working with somebody who's like 98% dialed in, it's just it's a low impact jobs, because we've worked with coaches all over the world who have worked with very, very high level athletes. And those highest level athletes are usually the least satisfying people to coach universally, this is what we've been told is because somebody else will get them there. It just doesn't take that much. You know what I mean? Like, getting somebody from 96% to 98% is just not that interesting. I really like to have the impact in my community and in the world of getting somebody who said 10%, to get him to 70-80%, that changes lives, that changes families to just communities. That's the impact that matters to me. So I'm just not super concerned with somebody who already has most of their ship dialed in and just needs me to know that it's just not there for me. So if you're trying to generate leads, okay, if you're trying to attract people to your services, there's a lot more people who are way farther off from being dialed in, which means someone's going to say a personal trainer, the solution to them getting goals is excellent. Yes, exercise is big, it's very important. But you and I both know this, you can coach the shit out of somebody in the gym. And I've seen it and if they just if there's nothing addressed about their nutrition, or what they do is they'll work hard in the gym, and then just use that as an excuse to say I did this. So now I don't have to bother with any chain making changes in any other aspects of their life. They choose paying for a trainer, as a way to almost offload the responsibility for the thing that they really know is the problem and don't give them that out. And that's what I'm really saying, not people are gonna buy or they're going to buy, you don't need to force them to do that. But you do need to say like, just be neutral, like working out doesn't burn that many calories, you're better off taking six fewer bites of something shitty a day, something bad for you, today, six fewer bites will get you almost further from a fat loss standpoint, then a lot of fucking extra, like a lot of hours are working really hard. So it's just not worth it. And

John Fairbanks 08:59

So one thing I wanted to call out is the most pushback we get, whether it's inside of the gear academy or when we're just generally talking with other gym owners or personal trainers. My people don't care. It's almost as though the idea of fat shaming, right? This new fat positive body movement bullshit is tainted and has ruined how we all collectively think about body composition. Because now it's not appropriate to be able to say, I would like to be thinner or I would like to look better or what does that mean? Does he not want to look at you oh you want to be you're not? You're not? You're not confident or proud of who you are. And if you're a fat fuck or if you have to lose some weight, or you wish you could be stronger. We now all have to do this big group hug And what it is you get pushback on is a little bit of this woke bullshit, which is people come and be like, Well, my people, you know, they don't care

Tyler 10:08

about you, they're not interested. And it's the same thing I hear from people who say, Oh, my people will never pay that much for my service, just in general route, if you're trying to, nobody's going to prepay for 12 weeks of personal training. And I was like, Okay, well, you're just not fucking asking, or you suck, that you literally suck at doing it. Because otherwise, it's very, very easy many of our people do. And so when someone comes to us, and they say, like, all my people are buying, it's like, okay, you're not offering it. That's usually how it goes, you just start offering it, you're not you don't, you personally don't give a shit about it is usually what happens as well. So if you're having a hard time selling this, stop trying to sell it. This, this is the number one thing, offer it to people, and then just explain it in this way, the way I'm explaining it to you, which is like, Listen, you came to me to find these terms of success here, which so you'd like to lose some weight, I'd like to be make sure that we can prove that for the same reason someone who's looking for fat loss should be paying for your nutrition services, instead of just going to the gym. That's the same reason that they should be participating in some sort of measurables program where it's like we are going to weigh you, we're going to do body fat scans, because they wanted to lose body fat. And it's very important, because for them to be successful. If they're training for a month, and nothing goes, they don't lose any weight, don't lose any fat, and you're coaching them on nutrition. That sucks, man, like they're fucking lying to you, they're not doing it. But if they do have to come in, let's get on the scale, just checking to see how we're doing here. That account that holds them accountable, that makes accountability a thing, we're not having to do this day to day hand holding, it's like, here's when we're gonna check in. And that psychology that I've talked about this before, if you weigh a person every day, if they just weigh themselves every single day and make no other noticeable intentional, deliberate changes to their nutrition or lifestyle, they will still start to lose some weight. You know why? Because they will make a bunch of subliminal little changes because they just know everything. But every day they got to look into it. It's a part of the observer's paradox and it's real. So when you get into this situation, I've run into this before and I want to explain to you this resistance you talk about where people will say hi, you know, people my people don't really want it. It's like well to one if one we've said you're not offering it whatever, too. Are you actually advertising out there like promoting not advertising paying for ads, you can do that as well, of course, but and you should be but advertising gets weird when you're talking paid ads for fat loss and shit. They don't get strange. Yeah, so you've got to be healthy, it's got to be fitness stuff. But your organic stuff, you should be talking about the shit that people want. So if you're not getting enough leads into your feeding into your system, like maybe and the PEEP and the people you're getting are just really not interested. Like I'm really not interested in, you know, improving my body composition and making sure that I can prove that it's been improving, and so that in the long haul, we can make great improvements, instead of just waiting until Sunday, I'm jacked. That means you're attracting people who aren't interested in improvement. Well, that means then if I'm looking objectively at what you've been putting out in the world, social media wise, or what people are attracted to, they're not coming to you to get better. So you're not talking about getting better. So all these people who want to lose fat, are looking at your stuff, and apparently not being attracted. And the only ones are the ones who come in and don't want to look better with Jesus Christ. What a missed opportunity. So you're missing out on nine because 90% of the people who I call who I work with, and who fucking Megan works with, and who the other gyms that we work 90% of them, when people are running these systems, right, all of them will say that improving their body composition is the reason that they're there. Or is one of the things on the line for them to be successful.

John Fairbanks 13:59

You and I dedicated an entire episode back way back in 2022 That was 100% dedicated to like the top 10 metrics for why people choose and come to a gym outside of being closest to your home, which was the number one reason why someone choose chooses a gym is because of the location of either where they work or where they live. It was body composition now if I think it's important because it to call this out directly to which is if you choose not to go after body composition one I think you're just being a pussy about it and you are fucking yourself over business wise, by completely ignoring the largest percentage of humanity that needs help. And right now is has horseshit advice that's being given to them all the way down to having surgery on kids that are fat instead of having them stop eating bullshit and just and

Tyler 14:55

you're just gonna as a business owner highroad them by saying I mean it's not that important. if I'm above it, though you're not above it, you're not fucking doing it for people. That's the problem. Because if you were delivering really effective, incredible fat loss results, and you were putting that out there, and you were showing those testimonials of showing those results, and its whole point of measurables. To us, you can define other successes along the path there. What the fuck kind of opportunities are you missing? And what are you doing that you're just letting people come in and live their life plateaued fitness wise, body comp wise, performance wise in your gym? Because that's what you're encouraging by not doing this.

John Fairbanks 15:33

Now, the one thing so this is what I want to do is yet we've established your policy, we disagree with you. But here's the next piece. And this is what's the most problematic for me, is that because everyone assumes when we talk about this, this is the the pushback that we get when we talk about measurables is that it's because you only view measurables from a body composition standpoint, and you're playing your flag and fat and fat lands thing and say, No, I'm better above it. And you choose not to do measurables. So you also have to understand, Okay, fuck, don't do body comp, because there's too much of a thing for you to be able to handle right now mentally and emotionally and spiritually. But if you have people that are there with you to where maybe you do have a bunch of athletes, or you have weekend warriors, or you do have, again, what we talked about the very beginning establishing the expectations, why are they why are they there? And why are they training with you? You have to have a fucking measurable so even if it's Grandpa is there, she wants to be able to sit on the fucking shitter without falling and being put into a home because she breaks a hip, guess what, you have a measurable and

Tyler 16:45

ready for ready for military training right there military physical, perfect, here's where we're at now. Great. Let's get this improved, boom. Now these things matter. That may be combined with the body weight and boom you have now. But the performance is what the performance is, you know what I mean? I'm a five year old, I'd like to improve that perfect. Again, the outcomes of your training are obviously much more than just body composition, and mild times and bench presses and all that stuff. It's so much more than this. But you have to fucking somehow you need some data, because it's important. And the reason this data is important is because the mirror will lie to your clients, even when they're doing well. And they're so different from most of the ones who have maybe let themselves go for a while, they've been ignoring the mirror for a long time anyways. So even if it starts going the other direction or is not improving, they're just going to hide from it. Okay. So when things do start improving, they're not really going to know either because they see themselves every day. And it's a long way, usually in someone's fitness journey and weight loss journey, before people in their lives start to notice and start to say things like, oh, have you lost weight? You look great. Okay, like, there's a, there's a, there's a long that curve is a bit more, what's the word levelled out, like it's not, it doesn't happen all of a sudden, like suddenly, it's not just like, damn, I look great in the mirror, damn, I'm down 15 pounds, tan, but like, you may when you start training, build a little bit of muscle and then fucking be losing some fat, especially if you're brand new, which means the scale may not move that much just weighing maybe isn't enough. Okay, so now they're gonna see the scale stays the same. That's a psychological loss. And one of the most important things when it comes to being a coach, a coach is giving your clients wins. And you're taking wins away from them by choosing not to fucking apply whatever their metrics for success work. Okay, and make sure that you check in. And so maybe the not everyone has an opportunity to be sold into a product, but it can be right you can have a performance assessment that sits as your fucking measurable piece, we're gonna check in, we're gonna devote an extra session to this, I'll do a good write up in a deliverable to you that works, right. And so I think that there's another piece to this, though, that I think matters a lot is on the accountability, the accountability side with your clients. Okay? Now, I have experience with this because I sell these products as well, when I want personal training. And the measurables almost seem and you will get people and this is one of the guys a year kind of said the same things. Like I'll have people that will want to choose my highest training package, but they'll ask if I can remove the measurables like find totally one, whatever, go for it, let them take the money off or whatever. Most of the time though, they'll just buy it and then hope that you don't do it. That's the other one. They'll pay for it. And they're going to try to shy away from it. Right. So I have a client who says it was the same exact thing he wanted to do. He wanted to do the thing and was ready to make the change. Everything is lined up to him. I want to make this happen. I want to go from here to here, here to here. But when it came to the nutrition stuff, it was always a little delayed. Like yeah, I'm about ready I want to get through. And finally what it came down to is like I'm not going to allow this. Right. I had to say I am not going to let you hide away from this because what they're doing by pushing that off, say no, no, don't hold me accountable to this. Don't make me weigh myself. Even though I said I want to lose 50 pounds. Don't make me weigh myself, let's never weigh ourselves. I don't want to do a body fat scan either. Like, like, if they're avoiding all that stuff, what they're avoiding is success. What they're avoiding is actually having to change themselves. Because as a coach, you're going to find a person who goes from overweight to fit. It's not the same person yet you're dragging through that process, okay, that person needs to change from an overweight person with bad habits and with overweight habits to a fit person who does fit person shit, which means you just need to become a different person, you are who what your habits aren't all these things need to change. So people will subconsciously or very consciously subvert their own chances for success by avoiding the accountability to their own success, like I don't want to look at my bank account. I don't want to know, I don't want to know, I know it's not good. I don't want to look at it. I don't want to know, I'm gonna avoid this. I don't want to know how much I weighed. Okay, not by the way, avoiding getting on the scale, when you're, is a thing that people do when their stuff heads the wrong direction. When you know, you're not paying any attention, you're letting yourself go. That's when people will stand on the scale for the first time in three months, four months ago. Oh, fuck. And they know they've been avoiding it. And they know why they've been avoiding it. So do not let your clients who have goals that are defined by weight loss, fat loss, and all this stuff. And they need nutrition coaching, don't let them off the hook. Don't Don't put it so this is if you sell someone into something there is zero chance of success, and you know it's on you. Okay, meaning if I have no personalized dogshit nutrition habits, and they want me to give them results via just personal training? Like I can't help them. I just can't help them. So even if they don't buy my coaching, are you willing to eat less? Are you willing to eat better stuff? Are you willing to at least do that generally, because if you're not going to make any improvements there, all I'm going to do is you're going to learn a lot of things about exercising here and then, and then you're just not going to get any results. Your experience with me needs to be a successful one. It needs to be fruitful, or else it's not worth my time. And with John, we do this in our business coaching all the time, I'll tell clients we have constantly, I don't care, like I'm all about a good idea whether it's mine or not. I'm also all about shitting on a bad idea because it sucks, right? And if a bad idea sucks. I don't care if you do it, man. But if you want to do something stupid, don't bring it to me first. Definitely, just go because I am then going to rip it up and say No, I think this is dumb. If you're just going to power forward into it, don't take it to me. Because I gotta tell you, I think this is a terrible idea. And it's to say it goes the same way with your fitness clients. If someone comes in, and like, I have personal people I'm describing to you, all they're doing is starting to put up barriers around them, walls around themselves, so that they can sequester themselves away from you. And shy away from any potential success that they're going to have. Because they've always failed. They know they've always failed, that's why they're here. It's always gone the wrong direction. So for them to fix it, they're going to have to actually move forward and they don't want to because every time they did now what's they they're set up to fail, they're gonna go forward, and they think they're going to weigh themselves in two weeks and get a body fat scan in a month. And it's going to be worse, because it's always worse. So don't give them that. Because once they build that up, you will know the fall guy. Because then they say I spent the money on this trainer. And it didn't work. Don't do fucking business with those people. You know, and you need to be able to communicate with these services. And for the reasons that I described like, well, this is literally how we know it's working. And if it's not working, we'll make some changes, and you need to be accountable to your own success. One more piece of this quality control for your coaches is a huge one. Because what? Absolutely, and when I look at this, this is a very important piece that I see a lot. I see gym owners failing this with their coaches all the time. Okay. What would your coaches need to do as far as being bad at their job? What would a coach you hired? What would he need to do for you to fire him? Like what performance metrics are out there where you would fire him because I hate to break it to you and being likable, friendly, showing up on time those are not exceptional. They're not exceptional at all. Okay, your fucking be a cashier at a gas station. Those are criteria. People have to like you, when you talk to people you need enough fuck it up in to get through whatever this trick interaction is that we're doing here, and you need to represent our business well, you need to show up on time you got to be presentable like, but literally with gym owners with when they hire coaches like that. That's like the only thing people like him. Well, great. And now none other people are getting any fucking results. So you need to somehow have your coaches be accountable to the fucking results of their clients want. And that means when you define the terms of success for the client that needs to actually exist somewhere probably in writing and your back end systems. Write in your client folder, what are their notes, hey, this person is looking through this and this and this by this time. And when you actually enter double measurables for the sake of accountability for your entire business and the client, everybody, for the services for the coaches, for the person out on the street for their hours their spending away from you in the gym. This is how you create a successful endeavor. If you can't measure it, you really can't manage it.

John Fairbanks 25:19

And if you want to scale the importance of why you as the gym owner, you have to buy in, it's mandatory, you have to buy in to having a metric system of how you are, how are you are establishing how every client is successful how your business is being successful, you have to have numbers, you have to know your numbers, and your clients have to be aware of what is going to what numbers mattered to them, to help them be successful, all based off of these expectations you set ahead of time. But most importantly, if you're a gym owner, you are not just a coach, you're not just a personal trainer, you have something wrong with you, you have that itch that's in the back of your mind, that makes it to where you wanted to do more. And because you wanted to do more, you have a lot of nuance for why you do what you do. And there may be a lot of things that you don't realize that you do. But because you have years of experience, and years in the saddle or years of working with a certain type of client that you just know certain things to do. I Guaran fucking tee your coaches don't, they don't have that nuance, there's a reason they're a coach, there's a reason when you hire people, you bring them in, there's a reason they don't know what the fuck they're supposed to do, unless you tell them and hold them accountable for it. If you're gonna be a successful gym owner, and you want to scale, and not be responsible for coaching every fucking hour that's available for clients in your business, you have to trust and hand the baby off to maybe folks that aren't as qualified as you that are only working their way up to be 80% as good as you. If you don't have a metric for when their client leaves you now finally have a coach so you can have them personal train some of your people. And that client leaves and you don't know why. Because you weren't fucking coaching them? How are you going to know? How do you have any idea what are the metrics that say, is this guy that I'm trusting with my people, my brand my money? Is he holding up his end of the bargain? What are the metrics that allowed that person to be successful that he was coaching? If you don't have it, and you don't fucking know, you're in the dark. And I'll use quality controls. And he's a good guy.

Tyler 27:47

Exactly. People like him greatly. Well, people like him because they can hide from their own failure and just be like, Oh, I'm here with this guy. And that's okay. I had fun looking, but I had fun, but I had fun. I've been working out four days a week, but I'm still fucking getting fatter from year to year. What? Like, we're not in the business of health, and you're in the business of giving people a fucking playground, which is fine. But open a fucking bowling alley that at that point, because I don't know what you're trying to do. And you can have a place where people do good stuff. Right? And it's good. It's great for mental health. It's great people should be exercising, but I promise you, I promise you, people who are really overweight, like I promise if they can have exercise, a good outlet, and lose that weight. That's how you've actually made a change in their life. Otherwise, you've just given them somewhere to go, given them a good hour, and that's great. But in the end, it shouldn't be forced to. Yeah, I'm just not interested in having my stuff that I do not have at work. So that's it. It would be super frustrating for me. Now, I want to go through a real quick thought, oh, on the quality control side, there's another side. Can you hear that noise behind me? Or is it not too bad? Thank you. I'm trying to back it down and speak up a little bit. We'll make that alright. My apartment this building has been flooded so they're doing some work and it fucking pisses me off so we'll get moved up. But quality assurance as well though for the coaches right there their accountability, they should be accountable to client results and the client satisfaction client satisfaction is not always tied to just results. It's not just tied to fat loss. It's not just tried to tie to their lifting numbers. However those things should be tracked and they should be a part of your system. It's also just did they have a good time? All those things? Do people like them? Did they enjoy the session? Did they feel like the session was effective? A great way and I don't know if he still runs it but a friend Willem used to do this. At the end of each session. There was just an iPad on the way out the door. You know, you go to the bathroom. You come on like a public restroom with the iPad that you're supposed to touch to say whether it was good or bad or whatever I'd be washing there's basically that for the gym. Right? And so after every session, I was the coach. How do you think the workout was? Did you have fun there and whatever but it's real quick. Boop boop boop and Getting that type of feedback. Maybe you don't do it every session, but maybe you shoot someone an email once a month, that's just Hey, answer these great ones through five. But you need to have, but that stuff matters as well when you're trying to scale. Because if you're trying to scale and you just got a guy that people like out there, great. There's some guys that have clients that people like, and it's because those are they have clients that like them, that I see coach out there who like Don't fucking get anyone any results. And the only reason that the clients like them is because they're likable, and they don't know any better. The moment they start seeing good personal training out there, and like a real quality engagement and some good work and, and instead of it just being this fucking loose, mildly disrespectful, fucking uncaring nonsense, you know, spending 30 minutes just hanging, right like that on your phone half the time, they just don't know any better. So they'll continue to pay that person, you know. But this is a thing where you need to be accountable to all of those things, not just likable. But did you think the workout was fun? Or was it too easy, too hard, right? Both everybody is saying your workouts are too easy, then maybe you got to there's something you could do differently there, right. So all of those things are for quality control. That's why the word the measurables fit into one piece. Of course, this is for the clients as a product to sell. But I want to touch on this. I don't even give a shit about making money on this product. Matter of fact, my measurable costs take so little I charge like, oh, sure, I mean, maybe maybe like 50 bucks to do a quick body scan or something like that. And it takes me almost no matter of fact, that's just for the time I spent trying to get into visual representation to send out I'm still you know, putting it out documents sending it all. But even then it doesn't mean that like it's, the money has very little to do with it. Actually, if it did, I would just charge more for it too. And I would be concerned with people, this is why I just bake that end to what I do with my nutrition stuff. Now, for the most part, because I would here's a little thought exercise. And I want you guys to do this, think of your gym, think of all your members in this process. If you had, say maybe you don't have one, because that's just but let's pretend you got an in body scanner, right? You go and you give a little handles and your fucking tells you your feelings or whatever. Now that's anyway, you grab onto the things it tells you, it tells you your body fat and weights and some local, some semi localized stuff. It's maybe not the best shit in the world. But it's pretty, it's something, it's data. And it's data that will be consistent if you measure it consistently. And so whatever that data is, what if you, let's not say make, but let's say told every single member of your gym, you emailed them all, and you emailed them all three times in the next week and a half about it coming get your free body scan, free body scan now, and a free body scan that we're going to do in eight weeks, right? And that way you can see, right, let's just pretend this then you have the thing you have the time for. So let's just say you did this, right, you offered it, which ones of them how many of them will take you up on it, I think a fair amount, right, I also would be willing to bet then that those people if they bought no other product, very likely the ones who got scanned in the beginning and got scanned in the end would probably show more progress in that eight weeks than they have there in any eight week period with you in a very long time. Because they're gonna start making different decisions simply because I got to scan, I'm gonna go and try to I'm gonna I want to try to make this work because I just want to see those numbers better on the other side. whether that's right or wrong. That's, it doesn't matter, just know that they will probably do more work. And I want you to also note, which people turn down the free body scan before and after, and which one's completely declined to take it. Those are the people who are hiding. Those are the people who either don't have body comp goals. I'm just jack, there's I've never met a tax person who didn't want to get more jacked. And by the way, you've met skinny people, they all still I'm generalizing but you've met skinny people and they all when I would get like semi skinny clients like runners and shit they would come in to sign up into you know, to do some shit to start working out. And they all want to get skinnier, none of them want to build any muscle even though they're all just gonna vote they all so just understand that right? They like even the people who are fit, would want to want this to be bad. Like they're the ones who probably want it more than anyone else. So just know you can. I promise you that people who turn it down are the ones who are really trying to hide, really, really trying to hide. And that's exactly what they don't want to be. They don't want to have their inevitable failure a week from now pointed out to them or simply sent to them. It's not even like it's publicly blasted. But that's a little thought exercise for you to do and to think through your members like who would take me up on this. If it was all for it is all free. I'll pay your fucking intern to do fucking school scans on everybody who cares? Like just whatever this but just throw this out there. See what happens if you're willing You're not I again, don't give a shit what you do. But I promise you, the people that do it before and after, you'll have to do nothing else with them, and they will have more success. And that's why this isn't about the money or the upsell for me. In that product, it's about making my shit work. And I don't like doing shit, that doesn't work. I don't like rolling out on flat fucking tires. You know what I mean? Let's Arum up car cleans, let's go. Yeah, it makes

John Fairbanks 35:25

it better, right? It's a value-add that enhances an already existing product that you should be selling. We've gone deep into the weeds on selling any type of nutrition product before, but you should be doing it. And having this be bonded together just makes it more valuable. There's another piece that you talked about in the very, very beginning. But we also need to understand just by adding this, yeah, just by adding this enhancement into this thing. If you start to look at what your attrition numbers are, what does the retention look like when you have people come in and are working with you, especially after maybe they buy a bigger package, and they do something that was involved in some type of goal that they had, and they've hit the goal? Your ability to say, you started here? And man, you made it here? That's fucking awesome. What are we doing next, the ability to now have that conversation and retain that person, possibly at that same level of service. And at bare minimum, keeping them involved in your community as a whole. Yeah, it goes way up. I'm talking like three, four times your ability to be able to retain someone because it's what we see happen each and every time. It allows

Tyler 36:39

you to really force the value of what you've done. That's the main thing. So when it comes time to renew, if they paid for nutrition service, maybe they didn't plan on paying for Nutrition Service forever. Maybe they did, maybe they don't plan on paying for personal training forever. Well, what do you what's gonna give you the best chance saying look at this look like John just described that gap. Look at where you were, look where you are now. It's awesome, man, really proud of you. You really, really did it. And then they can say, You know what, I got this, let's go down to the, and that's okay, by the way, then they may just want the measurables to make sure they don't get off, then it becomes a product you can just sell an ala carte after that. But yeah, it's uh, that that piece is not to be slept on, for sure.

John Fairbanks 37:21

And because you show them that gap, they're high on the hog. They're super excited, whatever you want to call it, they're pumped there and they were successful. Your ability to now ask and get a high quality testimonial out of that person goes up exponentially because now they're fucking excited you gave them a reason to be excited. So you really have now and which we talked about the ability and to harness and then repurpose those testimonials into your social media content and the paid advertising so many different things and it doesn't have to be man was one of your ads he put out there which was amazing was big, fat white guy and at the end of training with you get turns into a Jack Black guy, right? That's, that's gonna be the before and after picture if you work with Dr. Stone, right? I love that. But it doesn't always have to be.

Tyler 38:12

And it said, probably.

John Fairbanks 38:18

But don't. Don't get your shorts and curl up in a bunch. If you're like, Well, I don't like the before and after pictures and super private and it's emotionally too damning. Don't do that, either. But do something similar. It's like man, Babs Barbara is at seven. Barbara could not stand up out of a chair without being assisted by her cane. And Barbara is kicking ass. And she's going to be fending off all the dudes that want to get into her pants now that she can walk and dance at the fucking line. Yummy fair, like it's anything, your ability, and only if you show which one?

Tyler 38:55

Exactly. And I do think it's important to touch on that when it comes to this. So I was talking to a trainer who has some clients who used to train with somebody else and this other person was known for delivering high level transformations. It was crazy. 30 days of shit, right? It would just like for anybody like an apple and a salad. Like every day that was it and people dumped 3040 50 pounds in like a month was insane. Should we just break them all? I don't know any of these people that didn't put all that weight right back like some really really misguided shit. But he would have these people take before and after pictures and he would go in with them, man or women, whatever. And just like not what you're saying. He would literally like to make them stand pudgy. Like literally make them turn in the saddest shit and take the before pictures. And then in the after pictures, he would literally go through and like no need to turn here and he just sucked it in. It was that thing, it was the most disingenuous shit. And I can tell you still before that is short sighted because it's lying. It's misleading. It doesn't work. It's not sustainable, your reputation that's going to All town like this, you can't, can't do that for a lot of years and not have people think you're a fucking charlatan. So. But now these clients were working with someone else I know. And they still they're like, they're like a different type of food so that she offers always have these people take before photos, if you want you can do over I can do whatever. And the client was like, Oh, you're not gonna make me do anything we're like about it. And when I do, yeah, whether it's remote or in person, my nutrition coach in the instruction is going in the bathroom right now to find a spot where you can always set your phone every time. Or my cousin says, just make it consistent, I'll give a shit. And just take a picture. That's it. If you're literally doing that, make sure you frown on your previous picture and smile. And you're after like, That's shit. That's the shit that people do. Just go and take a picture. And I told them, I said you do not need to send these to me. But I would like you to take one every week. Just take whenever we can keep them because it's important for you. Because again, same reason why body scans, I need you to have wins. And if from one week to another, you feel like you've lost and the data, the picture, the scale, the measurables show that you lost that week, then you're going to learn from that loss. And you're going to go forward, and we're going to win. If I allow you to hide in your fucking failures and hide from your failures. from one week to the next to the next to this the fuck am I for a coach? I'm just letting you sit and fail, which is the one thing that you're paying me money to not have you do. If we did this with a business to do with our business consulting? John, if we did, what coaches that don't offer measurables and let people how insane would that be? If every week I was just like, how are you guys feeling? is having a good day. It's like, No, we tell our business coaching clients all the time, we are here for one reason. And one reason only. That is to make sure you have a lot of fucking, you're making more money. Okay, and we want to make sure of course, that all this gets done to represent your brand. And fucking that you get more free time and you're able to have a fulfilling life as a business owner, and you can start to scale and still, like ethically do it and not be a slime ball. Like a lot of these people. That is our ethos, our that's our fucking our thing that we do differently with gear Academy, than I think a lot of the other business consultants out there in this space. But if we do all those other things, and people fucking revenue is flatlined, the same the whole time. What the fuck are we doing here? I don't want to do it, I wouldn't want to do it, I wouldn't want to work for them. I don't know, this isn't working. It's either you, it's me or whatever. But the relationship is not productive. So I'm cutting it the fuck out. And that's super important. You can if I hired John, if we hired an employee who was going to do some work for us, right, and his whole new Department of this business, right? But we just never really looked at all at any of their sales numbers, any revenue at all, we just liked the guy and they came in like, we would it would be insane for us to not look at just to just wait a year before we realized like, Man, this department has been losing its fucking ass. Like, it would be an insane way to do business. If you hired an employee and never ever just checked in on whether or not they were productive at all. You just never bothered to see if it was an asset or a liability to your business. At the most fundamental level, like the only level that this relationship exists for in a business, which is money and to have things get done. Like the tasks need to get done. And we are trying to make profit here to get Rob and yeah, and this is what people do with you if you're not making people put their effort where their mouth is, dude. So that's the thing is, it was a subject that had come up in the year Academy this week. As we kind of move some offers stack stuff around. And it's a piece where if you don't know what to do, or what you're going to deliver for measurables just don't charge any extra money for it. Just baking it figured out as you go. Sculpt scanner is a great one. I think I still prefer it if you're not familiar with it. It's cheap, it's pretty easy. Do not bother showing them anything regarding muscle quality stuff. It's too complicated as things change, especially when people are new, but you can there's muscle quality and body fat percentage localized muscle to muscle and so for that part, I kind of like see problem areas, just don't let the clients get convoluted and confused by data the other day to the muscle quality data is going to be more complicated from scan to scan, then you're going to want to bother trying to explain to them but the body fat one is the one that you need to use. So you use this, you scan it, you cut, you only address the body fat percentage data. And then you fold that in with all the other metrics that they decided like they wanted to have improved to be successful. It may be I want bench fucking 700 pounds, dude. Like maybe that's it and it's a perfect well 700 Maybe not the thing but improvement is the thing. Right? Right. So if in two months you're benching isn't any better technically whether it's a way to see to show you a video of you sucking at it and it looking like shit and a video two months later of it looking better, as well as some improvements and some notes or whatever that is but somehow you need to show me that your shits working because As I'm just laying there fucking pushing the bar, because I'm paying you.

John Fairbanks 45:05

And I think there's even another element of it where you are doing some type of an assessment and checking just how generally you're doing. Like, you want to be like, what are the metrics that you're checking, like for what reason do you do the programming that you do in your gym? Like, are people getting stronger? Is that why you have it there? Are they becoming whatever? mentally stronger, physically stronger? Are they getting hurt? You know, like, there was a period when I was in college where everybody, every player on the team, we all went through the same, our offseason workout regimen was the same. So everybody was prescribed the same train. Across the board. Everybody did the same thing with different coaches. And one particular year in a single offseason, we had 25% of the team tore their ACL 25%. It's crazy. It was it was a it was a fuck ton of dudes like we're like, a group of us. And we're like, what's happening? Like, what's up, none of us are like kinesiology majors. But it was enough to be like, something is happening, something is happening. And luckily, we had a good enough coaching staff that obviously went back and said, What were we doing, what involving the hamstring and the quad and the calf were we doing that was causing an over development somewhere, that's having everyone these 19 to 20 year olds tear their ACL and it never happened. Again, I don't think we had to tear an ACL. after that. I don't think we had another guy tear an ACL for the rest of my time, there were like three grades with no torn ACLs. And then one year with 25% of us.

Tyler 46:45

Just notice for gym owners, like your programming might suck to maybe your programming is just the wrong sauce, man. And that's why people aren't getting results. Maybe you're making people just do too much pasting shit, or maybe it's just too much intensity stuff. And people are pretending to work hard. Or maybe it's not enough slow stuff, whatever it is, I don't know. But if you you got to objectively look at this, if you gave away these measurables you just gave them away, which I don't probably recommend, but let's just say if you do right now that the experiment talks about four, if you did all that, and it wasn't working, you'd have to look at yourself, right? You'd have to either look, so what are these people eating? Right? That could be things that they want? Is it my programming? Well, you can't change what they eat unless you sell nutrition programming. By the way, if they don't show any improvement after eight weeks, and they're not doing your nutrition program, what a great opportunity to sell them nutrition programming. It's like hey, you've been in here you've been working hard we got to maybe fix some stuff outside of here boom, perfect sale. And do you also that you can control but on the other hand you can control your program. You just have to objectively look at me. My coaching sucks and my programming is just not good. Or it's not not where they need to be right now. And you have to be able to look at this because your services should work. It just should work if I was fixing cars and things are breaking before they're leaving the fucking parking lot all the time like at some point I gotta go Am I doing this right?

John Fairbanks 48:10

But what if it's a manufacturer right What if you are a good What if you are someone that really is good at your job and they are bringing you the cars and you are fixing it and then every fuckin Hyundai that leaves has the same goddamn problem if you know you can honestly check all those boxes and know you do the right thing at some point you're gonna call the fucking dealer and call the the actual workup and be like there's something wrong with these cars. Oh yeah, no shit, there's a recall. Let's make sure we don't say the metaphor too long so we go right to people. If you know you got somebody, they've been working their ass off. They're doing nutrition with you. And they're working their ass off and they really are and they're not fucking cheating they're doing everything you can then you give them some fucking bloodwork and go to a goddamn doctor because you just saved them years of the possibility of them haven't fucking diabetes or some other shit that they don't realize that they could get

Tyler 49:04

metabolically by the last guy that told him to eat an apple in a salad for a fucking month. And then now they eat 1000 calories a day and gain weight that sucks man like but you gotta know that a lot those sending them in at that point. If you've covered all those bases, do you have all those? We've talked about this? Often when you're talking about selling nutrition coaching and selling results, truthfully, it is and I think this is an old gym launch piece or one of the things we're most used to always saying but like, it's all about controlling for variables. That's it the variables that we can control for now we can manage them and if we can't control so if I have all these variables in my control, okay, it's almost just doing my group fitness I don't know if all those variables in control but if they're going the wrong direction, they're not progressing. I can say hey, we got to control some more variables. Maybe that's nutrition coaching, maybe that's supplements, maybe that's more private one on one sessions as well to make sure the efforts they're the right workouts fit are there. But once you've controlled as many variables with this person as you can And now you know it's something that's a variable that's out of your hands. And then now you can say like, Okay, if all this is really going on, we need to look elsewhere. Maybe you're just like super low team and your body's just telling you you're you know what, it's time to get fat crawl in a hole and die and just be unfuckable it's like well, no no that maybe we should fix up. Maybe you can fix this you don't have to go gently into that good night then that way so we can we can know where else again, are you trying to help people you're just trying to fucking be a worker out? Or who has a job?

John Fairbanks 50:30

Are you really trying to help people?

Tyler 50:33

So that's it, guys. I think it was a good episode. I think you guys distilled there's a lot of good shit here. I really hope it is framed, the way you look at this product, not as a product either, as I think it's just really critical for your services. I just really think this is the area you are turning on, the key to the car doesn't work when the person comes to get the vehicle like at that point, if this is it's that level of importance, I came in to fix it. Now I'm driving off and it is fixed. And that's what you're here to do. And we're not going to know if we just let people stay there. The car stays in the shop forever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever. So thanks for listening, everybody. Make sure you join the Facebook group, the gym owners revolution link is in the description there. You can follow John on Instagram at Jay banks, FL J banks FL you can follow the show at the gym owners podcast and Instagram. Follow me at Tyler effing stone and Instagram. If you want to cut all this bullshit out and get right to the shit, where we start helping you with your business right now right away. Let's get you in the gear Academy. So gear Academy and get you and shoot us a message you can either you can email to Your mom at Hackard Or just message either of us, or posts shoot us a message in the Facebook group or on Instagram or whatever. Just any one of those channels, shoot us a message saying what's the deal with this gear Academy, I'd like to maybe get in, we'll send you a questionnaire for you to fill out so we can make sure it's a good fit. You know that? That you're ready, you know. But from there Yeah, once we can determine that you're ready and you're gonna be a good fit, we can fucking start leveling your shit up like like really, really, really, really can't. So get in here Academy hits this is when you start talking about it and you start doing it. And we get well. We'll give away all this stuff we talked about. You can take every strategy I gave you today for free. Just do it all, write it all down and run with it. But the fact of the matter is, we can make you do it. And I think that's the difference. It's all the gap between knowing what you need to do and doing it is where success lies that success or failure. So you want to and you want to bridge that gap to get into the academy. It's where all the cool kids are out anyways. So thanks a lot for listening to everybody and we will see you next week.

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