The Gym Owners Blog/Podcast/The Best Starting Point for New Gym Members

The Best Starting Point for New Gym Members

Friday, July 28, 2023



people, gym, coaching, fitness, challenge, product, selling, services, market, business, semi private, talk, sales, classes, group, work, good, pt, open


  • Introduction of this episode. (0:00)
  • Putting up a barrier to competition. (5:54)
  • ​Where to draw the line? (10:43)
  • ​How many members do you need? (15:43)
  • ​Let you let them in. (19:46)
  • ​Selling people into your gyms. (23:39)
  • ​The principle of getting everyone in. (27:44)
  • ​Ease of getting people into your business. (32:25)
  • Nutritional advice that is gone for years. (37:05)
  • ​Looking for a gym that vibes. (39:22)
  • ​The importance of having a social media strategy. (44:08)
  • ​What are the access points for social media? (48:26)
  • ​What is popular will not be popular. (53:06)
  • ​Protecting your fulfillment capacity. (57:17)


TTyler 00:00

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to this week's episode of the gym owners podcast. I'm your host, Tyler stone over there is John Fairbanks How are you doing, John?

John Fairbanks 00:06

I'm doing excellent.

Tyler 00:08

This week, we want to talk about the different starting points that people can take your clients to within your business and how we've seen a ton of different types of approaches. John, you and I have worked with gyms to do many different types of you guys, you have to start here you let people choose some gyms only do one product. So maybe have five or six products but require this and this and this before you come in. And we're going to kind of cover the pros and cons of a bunch of those different options, different pathways into your business and starting points and what we believe to be probably the best way because it's I mean, if we don't tell you what's best, what are we really here for So, before we get started this week, we want to make sure you guys join the gym owners revolution Facebook group, that link is in our description. Also, make sure you go to gym owners If you want to get in on the gear Academy, work with us directly. have us help you level up your business this year, next year and for decades to come. That's the product as a gym owners follow the show at the gym owners podcast on Instagram. You can follow me at Tyler effing stone Tyler eff iron stone on Instagram and John, how can they find you?

John Fairbanks 01:16

You can find me on Instagram at J banks f L.

Tyler 01:20

And also guys, we are doing some market research. So if you're listening to the show, we'd like to maybe get some information from you about just the different struggles things are running into problems you're trying to solve. As we continue to collect data with some of our outreach, we figured we might as well make sure that those of you that are listening are giving us feedback as well on what's going on within your gym. So we can make sure we make content and mold our services to help you. So if you would like to participate, it's literally a simple Google form. We want to have you fill out an email at which email Do you want to want that at John?

John Fairbanks 01:53

Your dad and your dad

Tyler 01:55

at Hack your email us at your dad at hacker It's not a joke, your dad hacker And just let us know you'd like to help us out with that and fill out that Google Form for us. It's really simple. It doesn't take

John Fairbanks 02:07

What's it take, John? Three minutes. Yeah, tops and it's anonymous. So you don't have any weird shitty likes? Which,

Tyler 02:14

yeah, there's no there's no like, Haha, we tricked you now we need you to buy stuff. situation, we just want the information if you choose to, you know, leave your email. That's really up to you here. But we want to just collect some info so we can know what's going on out there in the world, what you guys are struggling with, specifically you guys who are listening to the show, because that's the big one is we can cover the trends we're seeing in the industry trends. But for those of you that are actually consuming this content, we want to make sure that it's worth it for you. So your dad at hacker Just shoot us an email in the subject line just put a survey, whatever your middle finger emoji, we don't care, it's finally ideal. Alright, so let's get into it. So one of the things we run into very often when we start talking with gyms, and figuring out what their sales process looks like maybe kind of making sure their sales process and their products and maybe some of their whatever their sales meetings are their intake process looks like compared to their products, sometimes we see really good novel ideas. Sometimes we see really convoluted messes of things that are just kind of fragmented and built on top of each other over and over again. And when you ask why something is done that way, there's no real answer. And when we ask if it's better that way than another way, there's really no quantifiable way of proving its success or its failure. It's just a thing that we've done, because we've always done it. And we don't tolerate that here. So one of the things we see very often is the PT first model, right when people first came in specifically with CrossFit gyms, like there were a lot of just sign up and join you may be doing an on ramp program, but you're just dropping into a group. That's the YMCA, Zumba model, the catch all you sign up, you're working on a group today, right? That's the Body Pump program. And I think a lot of CrossFit gyms started realizing they were missing out on one, opportunities to make sure that people are safer, making sure that they do get some more specific hands on coaching for some of these more complex movements. And to introduce people to that higher level of service right away one it made them pay more money upfront, going PT first and two, it just made sure that people knew it. Maybe they liked it. And if they went into the group and the group didn't wasn't really their style, they knew they could always take a jump back and just spend a little extra money and get to pt. So I don't think it's a bad model. I don't think the PT first system is necessarily broken. I think it is a tremendous access point. What I don't like is forcing that. I think you lose a lot of really good clients in that process of really good potential clients, maybe due to budget, especially if you have a product that is a general membership, a general group and a more affordable thing making someone take that big bite up off the front. Not everybody can. And unless you're at capacity, what? What is the point of what we John, we've done this before, too, we've done a similar thing where we did an assessment model first. Yeah, it worked fine. It worked fine. It sold fine. But that was a gym that was kind of full of this semi private coaching. And so it was a way to almost slow the entry, get people and get them aligned with their goals. It just kind of worked. But we don't promote that thing fully anymore, either. Because it started to convolute the sales process because if someone wants to come in and start putting a different ticket price in front of it and forcing them into it now feels like they're being shoved around, it feels like they're being told they have to spend more money, and your market may not support that.

John Fairbanks 05:54

Well. And it is, like you said , a way of slowing down people coming into your world. Yep. And

Tyler 06:02

if you do that if you're flooded with heat with people, then yes, obviously, you just create. And that was maybe one of the issues we kind of had here, it was a market which had high wealth. This business, most of their eggs were in the big ticket basket, and it was working, which meant we didn't really need to start to jam up the coaches with a bunch of hours of not quite as profitable work that wasn't the part of the business we wanted to send the flow to.

John Fairbanks 06:27

And you do have to understand your model too. So like, and what you're ultimately after, because what gets dangerous is a lot of times folks will be like, well, you know, how many members? Do you have that question? We've shut on that question for years, and for good reason. But how many members you have is really, really dependent upon how much each member is paying. And so if you mentally have a spot, like it's for that particular spot, there was a CrossFit gym that didn't want any more CrossFit people. Like at the end of the day that just didn't want CrossFit bros to be the only people that were in their spot, they made a very conscious decision where it was, we're not going to advertise CrossFit. We're not gonna do anything like the only because for their model, it was CrossFit as the name if somebody wants CrossFit, they're going to already look for us, but we're not we're going to put up really what it was a barrier, just not allow people to come in, keep riffraff out. And they were okay with mentally knowing that they they're there. How many people could they close? How many members they were going to get on a monthly basis was going to be lower? Yeah. And that's where the contrast of putting up a wall is. Okay, well, then how can I get people to come in and get more people in? Not with that much restriction?

Tyler 07:50

Yeah. Now one is another mode of another train of thought. Here is the challenge of the first model, which has been very much more often, when it's done. It's not maybe the only way that someone can enter your gym, but it kind of is what a lot of these places are marketing for. Now we're in our second or third, I think, what's the word ads wizard business growth in the fitness space like specialists. And they just put all their eggs in the challenge basket, right? It's it's, it's come in, you're selling you're selling challenges, you're selling short term transformations. The nice thing with that for the business is that you can kind of lump in some more scalable services like nutrition coaching, or at home workouts and with the app. So you kind of charge more money without having to worry about completely scaling up your floor time. I mean, not hour for hour all the way up. So it can be more profitable. A lot of those feel very bait and switch II A lot of times the pricing that's put out on those is very disingenuous. I don't hate that as an entry point. I certainly don't hate that as a seasonal situation. John, we like to have our gyms run challenges at least once a quarter twice a year, twice a year at best once a quarter, once a quarter at the most. But I think challenges are very valuable selling tools. And where's the line? Do you become the challenge gym like that, that now your reputation gets? Is that your brand? Does your reputation get weird when a thing with people comes in and they do it and they want to do it? Because they bought something that they thought was going to be just this is it I get in I do this challenge? And then I'm out. Are your processes able to keep them in? Are you able to engage them beyond that short term commitment? And what do you have for them after that? Are they aware? A lot of these challenges we've seen that people are running are kind of like it's not even based on their brand. We've seen some of this now where it's like, you know, it's just a challenge. It seems like it's a fitness coaching thing. And then it just happens to be going on at your gym, which is even trickier, right? And so, John I'll just I'm not against them. I'm a big fan of selling challengers. For me personally, I'm not a big fan of making it a massive part of your business, I think it's a thing you generate hype for, I think a challenge is an event. Right on internally and externally. I think it's, I think it's a great service, I think they're great products. Boy, would I have a hard time boxing everybody into that though, I think it's more a product than it is anything else.

John Fairbanks 10:28

And that's overarching, it's gonna be the overarching theme for us, which is like not having any of these, all of them are good ideas, and they all work. So everything that we're talking about are stuff that we have seen work and work for a long time and be successful. It's where we draw the line when it becomes Oh, no, like, this is all that we do. This is the only model and then when you tip too far over to the side, where it becomes, well, this is what we are, and all of a sudden you switch or you change, and you kind of abandon all those other pieces.

Tyler 11:01

Yeah, then you can kind of start to see the issue with the main thing with the challenges specifically, and the way a lot of them are marketed without your branding. You don't mean, you're just buying someone else's ad copy images, it just talks about a challenge, which is okay. But then you are spending money for not your brand to be promoted in your zip code, which is tough. It would really be nice if you were able to kind of kill two birds with one stone. And then but if that is the challenge, it does become like a major part of your thing. I think you start at the mall, strip mall weight loss centers, you know what I'm saying? Like, they're every town has a couple of them, and nobody really knows what the fuck they do. You go in and it's like, it's like half pharmaceutical half supplement sales half scam, you know what I mean? And it's nobody, everybody knows, like one or two people that went in there. And if you're into fitness, or you've had a few tries to stuff, any on anybody's fucking list of like, what they think is reputable. And so that's the thing I want you want to avoid is that kind of guilty by association thing, which means you do have to do it better, I think you should be a part of your brand, I think you should always be diffusing some of that nonsense a little bit, which is again, which is why I don't put all my eggs in this basket. Next, the next starting point, semi private only if you come in, before we unload you into a whole group or give you just 24 hour access, the 24 hour access model probably sits a little bit outside of this conversation. Because very few are going to require anything so my private only semi private is, I think, a tremendous product, semi private personal training rules, I think you got three to five people in a pod, everyone's maybe paying half what they would for a normal PT out your coaches producing two to two and a half times as much money per floor hour as they would if they're doing private personal training. So it's a very good bang for your buck product for your clients as well as for your coaches. It still is kind of expensive. For sure it is costly. So you are going to lose out on some of that. That bottom of the barrel people bottom of the barrel levels of commitment, bottom of the barrel budget, bottom of the barrel people that's not what

John Fairbanks 13:17

this is. Yeah, but it is fair to call that out, right? Because that's a big difference because we oftentimes can attribute to where it's like well, bottom of the barrel budget is the bottom of the barrel individual. And it's not necessarily that it goes hand in hand necessarily,

Tyler 13:30

but you know, if you're gonna have people spill McDonald's, Coca Cola on your floor and bring in popcorn and do that kind of stuff, like that's not forcing people into a CPT first or semi private product in the beginning that requires maybe a four or $500 upfront commitment. It does rule out usually the type of people who would spend 600 or $700 $1,000 in a month to then just come in and like blatantly disrespect and damage the property but but exceptions

John Fairbanks 14:03

you let Yeah, but if you live in an area if you are lucky enough to have a Planet Fitness in your immediate area there the cat fish of the fitness world, they are bottom dwellers, that pick up the $10 a month people right? So thank God they're there. Because the reality is if you are somewhere that has something like 55 $60 a month the odds that someone truly is going to be that disrespectful or that shitty to your spot does go down at least go

Tyler 14:37

a little bit if they're willing is if there's a planet fitness or 10 products in your area. Yeah, it absorbs a lot of those which is why I guess so I would never be stoked for Planet Fitness opening up here because it clears up a lot of bullshit. It funnels everything down. It would really clean up a lot of the nicer facilities and allow you to do a bit of a better job and sell bigger ticket items. It would be a good Rate differentiator. Right now the issue is your convenient 24 hour fitness models, at least in a lot of these areas. People don't can't tell the difference. So the only difference is they're all $5040 to $60. And right, yeah. And then across the gym, children had a couple 100 and personal training studios or whatever are just up in the air. You know, nobody knows what those costs are until you're having those conversations. So if you're looking for simple gym access, knowing that a personal training studio and what their hourly rate is or what packages they offer, it's never even going to enter your mind because you're just simply not looking for it. So I would love to have like a $5 - $10 a month product drop in here, and just let it accumulate the people that I simply can't afford to do business with.

John Fairbanks 15:43

And it can be scary. We've talked about this before, especially in the last few episodes, just because there are some like new planet businesses that are opening around some of the gym owners that we work with, and that we know. And the fear is that they're coming, that they are opening, and they're coming to town. And the fear always comes back to well, how many members do I have, I'm going to lose people. And this is the piece that can be the most scary, but fundamentally, like mathematically, you have to know in the back of your mind where it is, you are able to lose people. And this is where all these different models come from the reason why the PTE first semi private first and assessment first. All these things that make things more expensive, or you have that more expensive service is that it's if you raise your price by 10%, or 15%. How many people can you afford to lose 10% or 15%? Like you can lose them. But it's super scary. Because we were so accustomed to being like, Well, I gotta keep me, I gotta keep the people that I have. And we all know, there's a reason why I have you tell the story. We have a friend out in the Netherlands that has to do either a freeze where we talk purges all the time. Yeah,

Tyler 17:02

yeah, it's a big one. Once you're at capacity, exactly, everything's a breeze, you can then if you're truly a capacity, everybody goes to waitlist, you only open the gates for your most premium products that are worth the worth the most to you as a business that make the most sense that work on the fulfillment side that are profitable. That's the way it goes. And when you have clients who then are a pain in the ass, and you're at capacity, caught them, because it's of no cost to you, they're easy to replace, that becomes a system that is once that's peak now is on location number two. And that is one of the things and we'll kind of as we move into this next segment, this is that's a good fit for this is what a lot of gyms do. For the most part, whether you do group fitness is kind of the most common one we run into as well as 24 hour stuff. But it's just everybody who gets in. Like when you sign up, you come in and we just want to get you in and sign up for our cheapest product, whatever that is your most common membership thing with no other services attached to it just a simple product base. Here is access to our group classes or here's access to our facility, here's a key card right now that lets everybody in model, I think it's fine. As long as you actually have systems in place to inform these people along the way, let everybody in the model just meet , not let everybody in by getting them in now it's like a quick yes, just sign up, sign up, sign up. But it doesn't mean anti exclusivity or anything like that. What I need, if I have that model, where I just want to close sales and close on quick, and I want to close them to a base product, it's you know, not tricky, then from that moment on, I want to make it as easy on them to sign up as possible. Someone comes in and they're, hey, I'm interested join your gym, perfect, we go right to sales talk, right to get the card, let's go, let's just do this thing. We just get them in and get them exactly what they want, if that's what they want from there, because I would run into this with my, when I was doing onboarding programs for my functional fitness gym, right? People sign up and have to wait a week or two before we get a big enough onboarding group. And then I'd run those at a separate time and then they kind of get some, you know, and that's a treat it kind of like a semi private situation to start. But onboarding people like that. It's very tricky, because not everybody really needs it. And some people you're stifling their enthusiasm by coming by saying, okay, yes, great. And then we can get you in eight days. And then you won't get to do the whole thing. You're gonna have to do this and it's like, well, what the fuck this really and so if you get someone who comes in as like, we're not going to sign up and start class now. I'm a big proponent of just letting them let them let them in. But then it is your job as a business to have your systems in place to constantly inform them of their other opportunities to move up. And whether that is letting them know that you have personal training, let him know via email reaching out to them to talk to them about their goals and a follow up after they get signed up like, Hey, thanks for getting started. Let's, let's then almost revisit the sales conversation that I would have as we get into this next step, that you almost revisit that as a part of a larger process of your business, which is, hey, what are you looking to accomplish? Then you can check in on them after that timeline, Hey, how'd it go? How are things, you can do it via emails, correspondence, text message, you do it in person, if they're choosing a non coached product, you're gonna have to be there, be present and talk to them in order to get them to like you. And like the idea of your services and understand that those can connect to a high likelihood of success for them, then they will move and choose a coached product and more premium product or service, as opposed to access or class times.

John Fairbanks 20:48

Or they don't, right, they don't move up. And they do just stay right where they are. In the most uncoachable non labor intensive part of your business

Tyler 21:02

easy to fulfill one pile a ton of stuff. Yeah.

John Fairbanks 21:05

Right. Like there is it as you build out, you know that pyramid or build out your foundation for what you build your business on, you do want to have a percentage of income that's going to come in, that's not Super labor intensive.

Tyler 21:21

Just period your people who are in your base membership, whatever that is, as long as you have other products, other big ticket products that are aware of those people are the fitness equivalent to having an email list in another business. Correct. It's simply they're there, they're paying you money. First off, which is fantastic. And then there are subject to us soliciting them all the fucking time for the other things you do. As it should be, by the way, you're a business you offer service. Nobody gets mad when the car dealerships are like hey, come buy cars from Hey, if you're interested in cars come out. So it's nobody's like, oh, this fucking guy. It's like, no, these people sell cars, cars, right? The grocery store puts out ads every week telling you about the sales and the things they can do for it. And what, what's on sale for meat this week. So many gym owners like Oh, I get him signed up. And let me just let me just turn off anything that says a price and make sure nobody knows that there's anything else I can do for him. It's fucking maddening. So

John Fairbanks 22:16

do you realize like, Does anyone need a reminder that the grocery store has food?

Tyler 22:21

It's nuts. And yet there's so much effort every week, and that many of these gyms spend zero effort. I mean, none informing people who are already doing business with them, what else they can do. And in every other line of work, guys, I would show up to somebody's house to fix their air conditioner. Do you know that it was important for me to make sure they had even if it didn't come up organically in the conversation? I would leave behind? Like an accessories sheet. Okay, if you're interested in any of this air quality stuff, let me know and that would have options for you to turn the thermostat up. It'd be like a sales sheet essentially, right? So a little flier that had you looking for a humidifier, maybe air purifier, you're looking for a dehumidifier, air filtration stuff, new thermostats, whatever it is, okay. And I'll be back in six months, these were people that were just on maintenance contracts to which the whole point is that you say, while I'm here, anything else I can do for you? And no, okay, I'm good. Okay, cool, cool. Here, just make sure this is what you need to know that I can do. Otherwise, I'll see you in the summertime. Alright, cool. Nobody's fucking mad about that. And always, like Jesus, guys always hit me up. That's the whole point is you have a relationship with somebody who can help you who can offer you services that will help. So I think getting everybody in is fine. I always I always, we always should on this. Because what we're going to get to next I do think is better is a better access point for your business. But simply selling people into your general spot. Listen, if people are beating down your door, to just sign up for your membership, you better make it as easy and fast as possible for them the moment someone says no, I just want to, I just want to come in and work out. And if that's a service you have, you just say Yeah, throw me your card. Let's go. Like just no more stuff, selling them, stop moving them up, get them in, get them committed, because when you do that you've got them this month, next month, next month, the next month, that is your time. They're fucking in your gym, they're doing this stuff. So don't take that opportunity to go okay, well, let's have a slick sales meeting here we're going to sit down and it's going to be completely unguided and pointless. It's that's a terrible way to go to sit down to like, I'm gonna get to know I've seen so many gym owners trying to do this I'm gonna get to know you shit and you're gonna get to know me shit in the beginning and just drags out a sales process to the point like, this guy wanted to sign up and somehow you've decided to bore him out of it

John Fairbanks 24:41

or turn it into something that isn't it's now all of a sudden a therapy session. Like that's not what this was.

Tyler 24:47

And it's okay that it be about their goals if they want it to be but not everybody has that open to strangers. See, that's really important. I think that people understand as we go, we go. We go the other way right where I want the conversation Quick one, a bunch of goals what you're trying to accomplish, but I'm not trying to talk to you about your daddy problems, correct. I'm not trying to talk to you about how your mom used to be mean to you. Or what happened when you were a kid, this shit stupid. Stay the fuck out of this. This guy wants to join the gym, Jesus Christ. Let him join the gym. And then if he trusts you and likes you and is interested in your personality, your services or your level of expertise, so you can do for him, they will choose. So many of these fucking dorks out here try to make it about shit. It's not. And then they wonder why people don't come and join the gym. And they're taking advice from people that ain't never made any real fucking money in an actual business coaching and selling new people at all. They're following influencers and it's stupid.

John Fairbanks 25:39

And because people come because your shit works. The same people like it, it doesn't matter because it's it's people will will people may get tricked because you sound super fucking smart and all the things that you say. But then when they get there, it really is super lame. And it's like, this is like, this is like this is not, you don't or on the flip side, you just attract other people that easily could be convinced to join the Manson family. Yeah, right. And then and then you kind of are just building this weird cult of like misfit toys, which is fine.

Tyler 26:19

Red lights in the fucking morning like Come the fuck

John Fairbanks 26:22

on. That becomes now that's right, like,

Tyler 26:26

go outside your doors is nuts do this is that's what the fitness industry turns into. And it starts becoming up in Title hacking and optimization. And what most people need is the thing you're selling. Ideally, yeah, come in and get started. And let's do that consistently, a habit change and some movement. From there, your services open more doors, but you're trying to sell this high-level nonsense to somebody who can't show up twice a week. Correct. Can't put the fucking fork down when they're full. Every time they eat. That is a more reasonable starting point. Like just start building some habits and building some trust. Don't jump in. It's like trying to marry someone on the first date. Man is weird. You're putting people off. So get them in when someone shows interest. Make it as we've talked about this before, as easy as possible. No weird fees, no weird frickin fine print or none of that shit. Get them in, get them started. And just go yeah, get me your payment is one of the hormones the thing that I thought was, is pretty solid. Because a lot of people miss this. As soon as somebody says yeah, I'm in or we really get an opportunity to commit. Just shut up and get payment. Right? There's no reason to like, oh, yeah, you really made the right decision. And we're gonna do this. No, they've said this, that means they want us to be over. Let's get the payment. Let's go as quick and easy as possible.

John Fairbanks 27:44

There's a larger principle that's here on the Get everyone in concept. And this is where again, it can't be the only thing that you do. Right? And this is where I like having seasons of this. Why the fuck do you think we have Black Friday? Yeah, like it's, it is discounted. Now I fully appreciate when something was 699 on Thursday, and then come Friday, it was now 899. And then the price has been slashed. And now it's just 699. Like, I'm all for that. But at the end of the day, it is. Black Friday exists and is one of the most successful sales days on the planet for a fucking reason. And now, what did Amazon do? They created Prime Day. So we're at fucking Christmas in July. And I prime and when

Tyler 28:36

we're Monday, and so now, it's so it's the reason why

John Fairbanks 28:39

you do that though. So this is where it is there is I'm not for and we have shit on. And we have advise people against the idea of just the race to the bottom, discounting your rates, discounting your rates, discounting your rates, but there are times and seasons to be able to open up to make it to where you can get people to come in, where they feel a sense of real scarcity and urgency to come join. Because you do disk, you do have a limited time discounted rate. But you only get to do this thoughtfully. If your

Tyler 29:15

numbers and if for you and I let's come up with a loose guideline, in my opinion, a discounted rate, a narrow window once a year. Yeah, that's that'd be it for me. And by the way, that's not good. That doesn't mean discount your whole year. It is essentially an intro offer. You can do it by adding value. You can do it by, you know, half off your membership or one free hour or one free personal training session or half off your first two months if you commit during the month of whatever, but then you know there can be some commitment to that too. I'm okay then if you're going to get people into a 12 month commitment. You get them half off their first three months for Christ's sake. But I'm okay with it as long as there's something But that then draws people in. I also, I also as a philosophy, I like the idea of varying that as well, wearing the arrangement, because while it's nice to have some people waiting around waiting in the wings for your big, seasonal sale to come up, you kind of don't want people like not purchasing the other 10 months, because everybody knows in December, it's half price.

John Fairbanks 30:25

And if you fuck yourself up, and you do allow too steep of a discount for too long or have too much, you do just want to give people the excuse to then step up and say that they're interested. Yeah. And again, it's a tool in the toolbox. When the idea is no, we've because Tyler You and I have worked with a gym that was the only offer they ever ran, and they ran it like always forever. It was like a month gets two or three months for free. Yeah, it was just like they were not getting paid. It just was like, Well, someone bought, and then it was this massive 90 day window, before they ever saw revenue again, or potential of revenue.

Tyler 31:08

For similar reasons. That's why I also hate a too intense paid in full arrangement, for sure, it'll get paid in full, he better discount just a little bit. Because you are kind of borrowing from yourself to pay yourself. And doing that at a discount is fucking stupid beyond a certain point. So I think it's really important unless you simply are in a cash flow pinch, I don't think there's any reason to sell out your August for the sake of your APR. You know, it's not always the best way to go about it. I don't mind those deals, I don't mind it. I like it great as a new contract deal as well. There's nothing I hate more than doing that, like I have. I've seen heavily discounted ones go out heavily discounted, paid in full to go out, and you face it internally. And it's like you hitting it's those were the people that were already gonna pay you all year. So you guys borrowed money from yourself and set 30% of it on fire because you're fucking stupid and short sighted, you would be better off going to the bank and borrowing against their contract value at 10% interest, then you are giving them a 30% discount. You fucking idiot like this. And so I think that's important that when it comes to discounts, I'm with it. I'm about the ease of getting people and don't convoluted, don't make it complicated. Every once in a while, make a real, real open door real wide open door, make it really enticing to get people in and start doing business with you very specifically for the purpose that your systems processes and internal facing sales systems, we'll move people up that ladder and give them opportunities to be informed about what you do, and choose other services as their kind of journey evolves. Next, John, next, the access point for Jim that John and I prefer, this is what we build into our offer stack systems is what we've kind of tried so we don't force anyone into it. But this is what we fundamentally, this is a guiding principle that we've been working with since the beginning. And I have yet to see any reason for us to adapt. I will adapt when talking about data and information and what is right with the world and what gives people a chance to succeed. evolves, but gives people the choice. That's what it is first that, in my opinion, it gives you all of the benefits of all of the other stuff. Minus maybe a few, right? The big one here is if I have a true offer stack that gives people a choice of all the services I have, whatever that can be for them to start that maybe maybe in that sales process, my sales process was What are you looking for? Private personal training, semi private personal training? 12 week fitness challenge or group fitness? 24? Like if those are the list of services your product has? What if that's the first question that they get asked and they push a button and pick up. I'm actually interested in that fitness challenge. Well, the nice thing about that fitness challenge is you're gonna get a 12 week commitment out of them because that is obviously locked in, right. But what if they choose Group Fitness, your base model I'm looking for, when they go to the page for group, they should be presented with options still, that give them a great chance of succeeding. That may be Group Fitness on limited access, that might be group fitness with some nutrition coaching, it might be group fitness with some nutrition coaching and whatever else you want to do, whether it's metrics measurables accountability package, and then maybe the top option is a 12 week commitment with guaranteed results. But whatever it is, they've made their choice in the beginning, like what type of product they want, then they get in and they get to choose from that list all of those things that everyone on there, that is a chance to succeed for almost every person, whatever their preferences is in the beginning versus what it is and this final page of the offer stack. Whatever they choose, you're fine. to just get them to that. letting them choose allows you people who just want to get in and start you know I have to have this conversation with somebody who, no, I just want started doing class, I've kind of done some CrossFit in the past, I don't need to do PT stuff, I'm already kind of fit, you know, or whatever. Right. And even if they're delusional, right, it's like, just get them in, that allows them to simply choose, they feel ownership over that, right. And they don't feel like they have to talk you out of something, which immediately creates a barrier in that relationship, which they're going to be very resistant the next time, like, if you, if I do everything I can do to try to get you into PT first, right? And then you're like, oh, no, I just want to get in you reluctantly, as a gym owner, let them into your group classes. The next time you want to bring up personal training with this person is gonna be like this full, I'm not listening to speech, again, it's over there will not be moving up the ladder. But if that person comes in and gets to choose from the list of all your services in a nice, easy to understand way, it's gonna be a piece of cake for him to go, maybe I'll be interested in this after 12 weeks. If you're checking in doing all the other things that these systems require, check in and a couple weeks, check in an eight weeks check in and 12 weeks just via email, text message, ask them how it's going. Let them know via email that you sell supplements, you know, if they want to have a meeting and chat about it, they can if they want to talk to coach at the gym, about nutrition coaching, let them know like there's, there's all sorts of pathways that you can do to kind of just be planting these seeds all over the place and see what grows. And that's the real benefit of going first, because you still then get the biggest benefit of all the other things financially, meaning someone who comes in and is a PT person, and wants a big ticket product can still spend that kind of money. And if you don't offer that up front, now you're kind of you're kind of cutting your own throat versus here at So choice first, I think it is fundamentally it gives everyone the best chance to succeed because they fall in where they want to be and being shoved into something does not work in fitness, don't give this it has not worked. It does not work, it will not work. I don't fucking understand why the industry seems so. So like, hung up on that thing. You guys do enough different stuff. Give them a choice. That's it.

John Fairbanks 37:05

I think it's coming. Like, if we think about it is the same idea that like nutritional advice that's gone for years. You know, I mean, the idea where it's like, no, it's carnivore, or no, it's keto. Or no, it's this or no, it's that like it's, and it's a lack of respect for the fact that the industry, like humans, overall, are becoming more educated. Yeah. Like, it's using these old systems and these old processes that existed where it's like, before the internet existed, the where, like, if you were a fitness, or you could just stand on a fucking hill or on the stump and be like, I am in better shape than the rest of you. I know more than you. Yeah, the only way to do what to look like me and to do as I do is to do what I've done. And now people like oh, well, no, like, informed clients, is the reason why this is where we drive and where we push. And this is why we've seen success, because you can take all the way from the most uninformed, where they don't know, they just, they know they need to make like they know they need to make a change, they know they need to do something. And then you're just gonna guide them based on that conversation and guide them and show them hey, this is the option that we have available. And based on what they've told you, they will literally ask for your recommendation. What do you think? I can't tell you how many times we have gym owners and coaches tell us how often people just say, Well, what do you think I should do? And then you will literally be in the driver's seat of how much money someone's about to give.

Tyler 38:41

Especially if you have a system like the one we use, which is okay. Well, you said you want nutrition coaching, you said he had issues with commitment, accountability, and sticking to it here we got 12 week commitment up front, I got nutrition coaching and accountability to make sure you're doing the things you need to do with the food we're weighing in weekly. We're doing body scans once a month, and you get access to personal training and group fit classes. This is there like that. Now when they say what should I do to do it? Well, you said these problems, these are the services that solve it. And if the budget does not allow it, they simply move further down the line and pick something that the budget allows.

John Fairbanks 39:12

So that's all the way to the most uninformed person. It also handles the most informed who knows, I walk in? I'm not I'm not confused? I don't know. I'm not I'm not hoping for you to tell me what I'm looking for. I know what I've done. I've done it long enough. I want to look and see what you have available. I'm checking the price and I'm checking if you have what I need. Yeah, so I'm gonna go straight to those things.

Tyler 39:40

That's a good question. And so when you come into the gym, I'm trying to sell you this stuff. If I am trying to box it with our policy, John has personal training first, you have to have six personal training sessions. You get those at a discount. So it's gonna be like $500 for that plus your first two months or first month and then then you can kind of roll into having access to a class. What do you gonna say, No,

John Fairbanks 40:01

I'm kind of not. Yeah, like I've done this long enough at this point, I'm really, really confident and what I want to be able to do, I'm really kind of just looking for a spot that vibes is what I want to do. And

Tyler 40:13

If I had a program then that said if you came in again and different jobs, different places, and it says, yeah, here, this is what it costs to get in and get started to get everyone in the model. Yeah, here's the membership, right, here's what you'll be fine, you will be funded . That will drop you'll fall right into there, no problem. So that one doesn't miss you. But the other three probably would be absolutely right for sure.

John Fairbanks 40:32

And we're characterizing that those people will they're just not fucking invested enough.

Tyler 40:37

Yeah, but we don't, they don't belong and train. I personally train with people and work out with people who just don't want that, which is fine. But can your business support that many like hard nosed and people who will never do business with you within five to 10 miles of your place? The question is, can you support that many alienating like that many people in your market, which is fine if you if that's just not the service you offer, and you can still eat? Go for it. Now, Big John, you come in and I have now the kind of you who chooses the first option? That still catches you, doesn't it? I talked about what you're trying to accomplish. And you're gonna tell me I want to get bigger. I want to get stronger when it's a perfect, perfect job. Where do you want to start? And it's going to be PT first challenges, group classes or gym access, what are you going to pick?

John Fairbanks 41:25

So here's what's interesting about this idea is I was only going to come in and look for a spot to train. But if someone knows exactly what I'm doing, and they say, we actually have like a beef eater, motherfucker, challenge that six weeks, I'm now kind of interested, I wasn't looking for that. I wasn't interested in even having a conversation about it. But if you had it available now I'm like, Well, tell me about that. Like now. Now I will go down that rabbit hole with you. And you may end up getting a $500 sale when I was really just looking to find a spot. Just give me 50 bucks a month, next year.

Tyler 42:00

And And if all fit and if that's out of your budget, you're gonna land right where you wanted to land anyway, so you're happy, you still know we do so many things. Like I've said this before. You go to the car dealership and sit inside a real nice car, and nothing's going to sell itself and you got this thing does fucking rule. I've worked hard to deserve this, or all these features. The point is that you want it. That's all that matters. So you've seen something like that is cool. I can't afford it now. But that's cool. All I've done is made you want something and no, let you know that I can do it. You'll buy something else for me. But now I am the guy that has a thing you want. And you're in my gym doing business with me paying me money every month.

John Fairbanks 42:34

And I don't need the goddamn sales guy telling me that it's leather, or telling me that it's heavy under the hood. I need you to shut the fuck up. Step away from me, I need you to not be with me. I need you to let me decide. Or my wife and I go for a drive. I prefer you not to be in the car with me. Because we're in a spot that everyone is trustworthy enough that I'm not going to fucking steal the car while I test drive it.

Tyler 42:56

How much do you hate that, by the way I'll come with and it is though worse,

John Fairbanks 43:02

silently, sitting pretending not to talk about the car.

Tyler 43:05

Am I supposed to entertain this guy? Because he's not entertaining me. And if he's trying to entertain me, I won't like it either. Because it's just, it's, and I'm not interested in his personality. I'm interested in this car. So stop making about what it's not, which is what I see very often gym owners do exactly. In their sales processes. Here's a product. Here's what I want. I'm looking for this, this this this. These are what I have, would you go take it first and see what you like, come back. I like it. I don't like it. We move on. It's fine. It's practical. It's fucking grown up sales conversation. Right? Correct. So that is the first option. I think it's the best. It's the best of all worlds, I think you do different things, I think I don't think you can go wrong. I think everything else is a bit coercive fundamentally by its nature, if you're talking to someone who comes in and thinks that you would prefer group fitness, and you're kind of it turns into this Well, I mean, if you really want to accomplish this with everything is nudging around. And the other benefit of this choice is the first model, because it allows you to do all these different types of things. It allows you to offer a different access point for different people. Right, that allows your marketing to actually have a goddamn plan. So if you're talking about if you primarily only let people in for your group fitness, but maybe you do semi private, or maybe you do some fitness challenges, or maybe you do some personal training, right? Do nutrition coaching. I've already said that. If, if that is the case, and you're only bringing people in and selling people your membership, you're just you're eating shit all the time. Because as people that might want this other stuff. They're gonna come in and they're just to get talked to about a membership. And that's where you're gonna get all these messages on what's your price, what's your price, how much it costs to join, how much it costs to join, versus if. And so now you run out, you run into the issue that all these gym owners have when they're having their coaches or themselves or whoever execute their social media strategy. And by strategy, I mean, posting, that's it. There's no strategy, it's just me Making posts to put out their exercises or photos. You know,

John Fairbanks 45:04

We have a video and a content coach that we've worked with for years and two years now. And one of her phrases that I really, really like is you're not a Kardashian. Yeah. And the problem is so many people gym, fuck your goddamn coaches that are helping you with your social media or you are guilty of this. You're not a Kardashian, no one gives a fuck. You're, you're not going to be able to sway people by just showing glimpses into the life of

Tyler 45:37

Yeah. Which is marketed as a viable component of a larger social media strategy. That's it in my opinion, having pizza smiling faces showing what the exercises look like letting the view of the inside of the gym. I'm okay with an after workout photo, I'm okay with a video of someone exercising. go to gym, social media, John, we're at almost 700 Now something like that 800 that we've gone through and audited there is a very high percent of them are operating just with that. That's the only thing overnight percent Yeah. And so when you go to this now, or if you should do this choice based system, you can go out each of these things a person will come in, and they can choose personal training. Right? That means you can talk about personal training, I have personal training, we do this we do that we your specific goals, your frickin desired outcomes, your timeline with a coach that fits you, your personality, your style of working out, whatever, whatever your current level of fitness is, is fully adaptable to you. That is a great sales pitch for someone who is interested in personal training and maybe is willing to spend the money for it. Right? Because not everybody can, someone who wants to throw $1 membership is never going to pay $1,000 a month for personal training. They just simply can't, it's not not on their priority list. Same thing with challenges sells because it's appealing. There's a fixed timeline, we're gonna go really high. It's hard to commitment or commit very hard hard results like big time so this is why all that there's what was it like Insanity and 75 hearts and like all those every little like novelty tough, fucking Goggins shit that comes rolling out like go do this for 30 straight days, like, yeah, it works. Because it's appealing. It's a level of commitment that people can wrap their heads around, they don't have to become a forever exerciser to do it. So it kind of makes sense that challenges are appealing to people who like challenges. John's never responding to a challenge solicitation, unless it's already in the context of what he wants semi privately the same way. Group Fitness is a great sales pitch as well. Some people really really love it. I have clients who exclusively shine in the group fitness environment, they really do that go into group classes is grits, what they love, they only do PT every once in a while because they just need a little bit of guidance with stuff they're trying to do within their group classes and they want some extra attention. But they would have no desire to simply train solo. I have the vast majority of my private personal training clients who would not be caught dead. In a fucking group class with the general population. There's no not a bone in their body that is interested in that. It just doesn't fit. Well. All those people with disposable income and no desire to go in my group classes if all I'm showing is group fitness circle jerks, it doesn't do me any fucking good. attracting those people. It's a complete waste of my energy. it alienates it all, immediately, if I never talk about the thing. So this now gives you an actual strategy for your social media. These are the access points. Are you interested in this? Now you can make 20 pieces of content about the benefits of personal training and your personal trainers and what goes on and the different types of packages you have. Same thing with your challenges may have different challenges at different times. different challenges for different goals, different challenges, different price rates, like there are many different ways to skin this cat. And I think that it's very important that you kind of shine the light on every single thing that you do as an access point to the business because then when they come in, that's where they want to start. If you're only talking about this stuff occasionally and someone comes in and goes alright, it will all get boiled back down to What's it cost to join. It does have to stay about that product from the time that they reach out to you when they reach out to you. So what are you interested in? When you talk about running paid ads? Now your paid ads can cover that same role. your paid ads now shouldn't just be about your gym paid ads for your gym, or DME. Okay, exclusively if you're just like, here's our gym, join our gym. Great, that serves one purpose. Here's our challenge. We got this challenge for these goals for this price until this time, now that all of a sudden there's some it's compelling.

John Fairbanks 49:43

So that's why that's been successful. This doesn't mean that challenges are the only thing that you run for your likes. And that is worth marrying this concept of being married to the one single thing that a client has to do and being militant About that, as we've talked about, just slit your throat for everything else that you have available in your spot. Yeah. And it's in and it all comes down to most of the time when you're talking to these motherfuckers that are going to run your ads. It's like, well, no, we only, like the most successful things run ads for us. Challenges are the most successful we think we do is for you to join your gym for $1. Or no, we only do semi private ads, because that's the only thing that's most successful. Are you fucking serious? Like, at some point, you have to realize that this means that only these people that are helping you do marketing or advertising, they just do that one thing. Yeah. That's why it's the only thing that's successful.

Tyler 50:40

Yeah, I didn't want to tell you it's the only thing that hasn't been around long enough. Or there's, that's that's the big issue is that is it like a promise you this hyper disk? Well, this talk like the semi private situation are the challenges that everybody's running, like all these gyms are running, it's at paid ads, the challenge is very often these challenges are dark, don't say anything about the gyms brand, we've seen a few of the gym launch stuff, too. It's like other ads. So it's just a picture of a fit guy, or whatever, six week challenge or whatever. Right? And that, by the way, that's fine. It appeals to people. But at some point, you should be putting some resources into building your brand and other things that you do know that all that gets you as a sale, does not buy you any equity within your community, it does not buy you any brand visibility, which means your brand isn't even associated with that anymore. It's only the challenge to let people know that your place does that and other places, they don't even know that your place does that. Because all you're doing is advertising that challenge. And so there's not a public Association. And this is what happens when you let virtual businesses dictate what you do and your fucking brick and mortar. Don't let a virtual business come in and go yeah, we're just talking to run all these ads. And they run it like they're running like they're selling frickin educational courses, like it's simply not the same thing. And so I think that that's, that's gonna be the thing you're gonna see, we said this a year ago, as a challenge, there's a sale and they work. I don't think it's disingenuous, I don't think there's anything wrong with selling them, the public perception is going to shift at some point, which means you should always be talking about all the stuff that you do. Correct. And there's a line where I have sat with her, or knows, but there's a line between. Also evolving in your business, from product to product that works, to making your entire brand about the thing. And that's why I think there's diversity in your marketing approach. This diversity in these access points can be really, really helpful to save you from putting all your eggs in one basket, which is a big mistake. And also to kind of over communicate about one thing if you start a running club, and all you're doing is promoting running club, running club, running club running club, and people go to your stuff, and it's just running club. Well, those are always gyms that wonder why don't I sell any personal trainer? Or Why doesn't anyone come in and do my gym work in the gym? It has a ton of kid stuff. And they want to make sure that they can get more adults. Yeah, they're not open during hours that adults train. So like, if you're not open before 9am. Like you're missing out on probably 40% of the adults that have to live train before they go to work.

John Fairbanks 53:18

And then we have to market to fucking adults. Yes,

Tyler 53:21

exactly. And so just because you do a thing and talk about and push and sell, it does not mean you can neglect all the other things that you do well, because you will then be neglecting that entire portion of your market. That entire demographic of the adults who are in your area who can afford your services, who live three blocks away, and you've never talked about it. So then they don't understand what you can do for them. They have no clue.

John Fairbanks 53:44

And fads are going to come and go. Yeah, so what's popular and the best part is, as you all know, as if you've been in the industry for at least a couple of years, you know that it's all the same. It just is how we're packaging it. And what is popular will not be popular now and then it'll be popular again in five more years. Like it will have ebbs and flows. So you can't

Tyler 54:11

Tell me how keto is any different from the Atkins diet. Well, we have like a 90

John Fairbanks 54:17

proGenesis Thailand I don't know if you know this about ketones, but what they are, what

Tyler 54:21

They are as ketones are getting into people who talk about them are also dumb. 90% of them go keto keto is like Jesus, you're just eating less carbs. You know, but that is a thing, by the way. Who was there the other day? DJ Murakami had strong camps and Instagram. He had posted a data point from like searches on these fitness subjects. And it was basically based on this, there's these huge spikes in like the 90s for the Atkins diet. Sure. And then and then it falls off completely and so it was basically that like are these new pharmaceuticals essentially just the newest diet? fad Just basically the truth, right? You have Atkins and then you run paleo, and then you have plant based and then you have keto. And then you have carnivores. And then it's ozempic. And it's all the same, it's the same spike, the same drop off. It just is what it is. But you cannot fall into making everything about whatever these new trends are, which is important. So if weightlifting comes up and weightlifting becomes a huge weight, lifting gets a huge boost because of CrossFit, a huge Hirscher. Opening a purely weightlifting gym. It's a narrow market to the general population, you've got to be really good at compelling people who don't know anything about weightlifting, to start weightlifting. And that's the way in my opinion, every approach into marketing for fitness should be by my opinion, because everyone wants to compete over if I open a jiu jitsu studio, in a town that has trying to compete with people over the same consumers who already go to a jiu jitsu gym and already have an instructor is foolish, why would I even bother competing with them over p is saying to their members that I do better, it doesn't matter, all I need to do is sell the 99.5% of the population who don't do it. To do it, that's your target market. And in fitness, that's the biggest mistake I see people make is they try to just appeal to people who already know the thing they already know. And that's great. There's some visibility there. But Jesus, there's so many new people. So finding something approachable and a good starting point. And then from there, like we say, you can move people through more advanced, more complicated or more niche products and methods of fitness because their client journey is a lifetime client journey is a big thing that we prioritize here. And that is that nobody does this, you don't train the same way that you did 15 years ago, I don't, I do many different things, right. Northwest gyms, and different styles of training, it's different, everything's different. What I do for exercise changes every couple of years, just a little bit differently. And that means I give money to different types of places too and that's okay. But highly specializing you better have a very big market. Otherwise, give people a choice. And then let them move through.

John Fairbanks 57:17

There was a phrase we used that we've used throughout their lives. And I think I want to be able to differentiate. Because as you are looking at different styles, how you're going to bring people in, how you're going to get leads, what are the styles you're going to put in the very front? Are you going to allow a choice based Are you going to just get everybody in, we've used the phrase capacity, when you come to capacity, there is a difference between the literal capacity the fire marshal allows in your building, or the literal capacity you could like just possibly get away with and fulfillment capacity. Yeah. And that's where it's protecting your fulfillment capacity, incorporates all these pieces that are really, really important for us, which is protecting your brand can protect your reputation in your community, all those pieces that are very, very aware and cognizant of the fact that you're a local place with real humans that live by you. But it's protecting that fulfillment capacity unless you were there, unless you're at your fulfillment capacity, where you are now having a waitlist, or you have to do a free

Tyler 58:22

order your code or you're just busy on staffing falls into this as well. Right. So fulfillment capacity is really it's not just, you know, space, it's not just class size, like class size, you may your group classes may be completely at capacity unless you have to open up more classes, if you don't have a coach to fill another class time, your capacity till you can expand your capacity by either converting some of those capacity for earning by converting some of those people into bigger ticket stuff, rolling some of that over into semi private blocks, or simply getting your another coach open another time slot and you can spread that around then you can sell more people in your groups.

John Fairbanks 58:59

But there then needs to be a strategy that's in line and cognizant of the fact that you have capacity.

Tyler 59:09

Let's say my full John, I have openings though. However, I got a couple part time personal trainers who kind of are on their own schedules. And they opened up to me. That is kind of my only current opportunity to make my I don't want to run a total freeze yet. Because I'm still trying to solve some staffing issues in the group, but we're getting close. That allows me to start to shift some of my marketing budget marketing efforts towards my private personal training towards a semi private end. Some of my personal efforts into staffing, hiring, training new people, that now is how you kind of prioritize within your business what you need to do right now and what you need to do next. And then by being able to sing the song about a person, you just attract more people from personal training, by the way you can, you can incentivize it. You can go push hard for personal training referrals internally, but that now is the cover and move philosophy that is exactly where you're at. Let's now fill this because that will line our pockets more so that then we can hopefully buy us more time to start to cover our group classes or figure out where your next move is, where your next move is for growth. But it's very hard to grow inside one box with one product. And only limited hours of the day.

John Fairbanks 1:00:20

Or the limited hours of the day is real, because you're so goddamn busy doing all the other shit that you don't get to have that conversation that we just had. Yeah, so that moment, that two minute moment, is what we're doing with our gear Academy people, which is, are you looking at this? What is the next thing? What are our future casting plans? What are we looking at for the next three to six months, because there is revenue, the purpose of your marketing should be three to six months out, we should be very visible of where we want to go. We solve problems day to day, but we have an actual strategy and a path to go, and an actual fucking plan. And that's where all these tools, everything we've talked about this entire episode are all tools in the toolbox. We never demonized a single one of them. We only demonize the idea that it becomes the only thing that you fucking do. Because that's where you get short sighted.

Tyler 1:01:13

That is, that is an interesting thing to do. This is why a lot of these other programs that are highly specific, you're securely aerobics, your cycling classes, all the stuff that most of them don't exist in their own standalone business unless it's in a very highly concentrated market. Yeah, massive, massive, you're gonna want a cycling gym that has this exclusive product. Okay, I'm better. But you got to have the people you got it you got to make sure you have enough bodies because the amount of people that are interested in that at the moment, it's not going to be super high and they're not gonna stay in I'm not a ton of people stay in that forever and ever so know that that is that is a part of your game. But if you have a gym and you have some coaches and staff and people and enough interest, there's no reason not to offer that type of class or to try a thing like that to have that be one of the many services that you do but don't make it your only thing. Not if you're in this for the long haul and not if you're trying to be a boutique gym. That's it exactly that today. Guys, we ran over time. Thanks for listening. Make sure you go to gym owners also go to the gym owners revolution Facebook group links in the description. Follow the show at the gym owners podcast on Instagram and follow me at Tyler effing stone is Tyler EFI and stoning fund John at J banks f L. Groovy thanks for listening everybody. We will see you next

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